Three new citywide gifted & talented schools
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Citywide gifted and talented programs will open for the first time in Brooklyn and Queens this September, according to an announcement this afternoon by the Department of Education. Until today, “citywide” meant Manhattan — now, it seems the DOE has expanded the definition to three boroughs.
Two programs will open in Brooklyn: The Brooklyn School of Inquiry, a new G&T school in a brand-new building in Bay Ridge, and the Technology, Inquiry, Enrichment, and Research (TIER) Program, which will be part of PS 20 in Clinton Hill. PS 20 also houses a middle school, the Urban Assembly School for Arts and Letters.
The third new program, the Science, Technology, Enrichment, and Math (STEM) Academy, will be part of PS 85 in Astoria.
The Brooklyn School of Inquiry is designed to span kindergarten through eighth grade, and will open with kindergarten and first-grade students in the fall. The other two schools will also enroll kindergarteners and first-graders, and are planned to grow to fifth grade.
It’s not yet known how many students will be served at each school or how the new schools will share space with the already-established schools in shared buildings. (Watch the blog for updates.)
In order to be eligible for any of the six citywide programs, students must score at or above the 97th percentile on the OLSAT assessment. The scores for students who have applied for September 2009 will be available in April. The three existing citywide schools in Manhattan are NEST+M, the Anderson School, and TAG.
UPDATE: According to Andy Jacob, a DOE press representative, the STEM program at PS 85 in Queens and the Brooklyn School of Inquiry will each be able to accommodate two kindergarten and two first grade classes. The TIER program at PS 20 in Brooklyn will only have space for one kindergarten and one first grade class. The three new programs will provide 200-250 new citywide gifted and talented seats.
The locations for the three new programs were chosen according to available space and access to public transportation, according to Jacob. The DOE anticipates opening three new programs in 2010, one in the Bronx, one in Staten Island, and one in eastern Queens.
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So looking at last year’s numbers how many of the 97+ kids who were shut out of citywides would now have seat with this add’l 200-250 spots? Does a 97 kid have a chance this go ’round?
Comment by Anonymous — March 19, 2009 @ 3:07 pm
Any news on who would run these new schools? What curriculum will they be using? From my understanding, these are independent schools being housed in existing General Ed schools, and will have their own administration, curriculum and so on. I hope all this is fleshed out soon so that parents can make an informed choice if the opportunity arose.
Comment by QueensParent — March 19, 2009 @ 3:25 pm
The TIER program is a part of PS 20. According to Anna Commitante, Mr. Keaton will be the Principal. The Brooklyn School of Inquiry is a new program with Donna Taylor as “school leader”.
Joyce Szuflita
NYC School Help
Comment by Joyce Szuflita — March 19, 2009 @ 4:41 pm
Joyce, any news on who will lead STEM? When will we know more of the schools’ curriculum?
Comment by OuterBoro — March 19, 2009 @ 4:43 pm
To QueensParent: The principal of the Brooklyn School of Inquiry is Donna Taylor. She is an experienced teacher of gifted classes (she taught in the G&T class at PS 230 in Brooklyn) and is now doing a residency at the Anderson School. The other two programs will be part of the existing schools, PS 20 and PS 85, and will be overseen by the current principals at those schools. The G&T classes will be “self-contained” classes within the schools. As to curriculum, the DOE does have a curriculum for the classes, although not all G&T teachers follow it — some create their own. I suspect that the programs will be holding open houses so parents can find out more about them. Andy Jacob (DOE press rep) said that Borough President Marty Markowitz will be holding one in Brooklyn.
Comment by Pamela Wheaton — March 19, 2009 @ 4:48 pm
Pamela,
Thanks for the info. From what I understand, citywides differ from district G&Ts in that they will use an accelerated curriculum (whereas districtwides use the existing curriculum of their gen ed school). Is this not the case with PS20 and PS 85? Why are they called citywides if they will operate just like a districtwide?
I thought the idea was to have additional Anderson-, NEST- and TAG-like school models replicated in these new schools. It would be disappointing if this were not the case.
Comment by QueensParent — March 19, 2009 @ 5:03 pm
Hi QueensParent,
The difference between these new programs and the district programs may be more in admissions requirements than curriculum, although we will certainly interview the principals and put up previews on Insideschools of the new school and the two new programs as soon as possible. Only students who have scored 97 or above will be offered seats in these three new programs (compared to 90 percent and above for district programs), and the students will be from all over the city.
In their press release today, the DOE said, “Both district and citywide gifted programs teach an accelerated curriculum that provides students with a variety of enrichment opportunities. Teachers in these programs use methods and materials specifically designed to meet the instructional needs of academically gifted students. The level of acceleration is higher in the citywide programs, since all students in these programs scored at or above the 97th percentile on the admissions test.”
Comment by Lindsey Whitton Christ — March 19, 2009 @ 5:13 pm
I am so thrilled there is now a viable option for “citywide” programs for families in Queens and Brooklyn who could not manage the looong commute to the Manhattan citywides.
My hope is that these new city wide schools provide a faster-paced, more in-depth curriculum and are willing to modify pace and content to address individual student’s needs. NYC has so many children who are just off the high end of the charts in their ability to learn, and there are few options for these profoundly gifted kids. Even a regular gifted classroom is not enough. I think every child deserves to go to school and learn something new, even if the child has already mastered the typical curriculum for the year — or the year after, or the year after that!
My biggest concern is that the mechanisms chosen for picking ‘gifted’ — OLSAT and Bracken — won’t necessarily be able to determine which kids are most in need of that faster-paced, more in-depth curriculum to keep them learning and engaged in school.
I’m encouraged that one of the principals has been spending time at Anderson. I recommend that the DOE and the principals of these new programs look at Deborah Ruf’s book, Losing Our Minds: Gifted Children Left Behind, which talks about identifying and teaching gifted kids of all stripes, and Karen Roger’s Book, Re-Forming Gifted Education, which talks about how to address the varied strengths, weaknesses, and interests of the very varied “gifted” population.
I would love to know how DOE plans to monitor the success of these schools and hope very little depends on the NCLB scores, which are so far below most gifted kids level, and have such low ceilings, they are not an accurate measure of success. If the schools must be graded on tests, I would like to see these schools judged by individual student progress on tests that don’t stop at grade-level “competency.” I think the Terra Nova might be such a test.
OK, I am blathering on and on. I am just really excited and hoping someone from DOE might actually read this!
Comment by brooklyn mom — March 19, 2009 @ 9:15 pm
I am very dispointed of DOE.As I know PS 85 isn’t a great school. Why didn’t they pick another good school instead of
PS 85?
Comment by momof2 — March 19, 2009 @ 10:14 pm
I am very disappointed about the choice of the site location for the three new G&T schools. If one is from east or south Queens, these locations are as bad to commute to as the three in Manhattan. The site location of the one in Queens even has to battle with the noise from the N & R subways running on the overpass track. What’s the point of providing an accelerated program at a site location only to put the “brightest students” through a school at which they are to be distracted by the noise?
Comment by DisappointedParent — March 19, 2009 @ 10:49 pm
I am disappointed that one of the schools will be a part of PS 20. We live in Fort Greene and are zoned for PS 20 but many neighborhood parents have chosen to send our child elsewhere for Pre-k. I was hoping that all the new citywide schools would actually be NEW schools rather than part of existing mediocre schools.
Comment by Anonymous — March 20, 2009 @ 7:11 am
I’m very disappointed that the DOE’s announcement didn’t include more citywide gifted–or at any rate selective–middle schools. It’s true that one of the schools will eventually include instruction at the middle school level, but this will come years too late for my child.
Comment by district 13 parent — March 20, 2009 @ 8:29 am
Does anyone know if the new schools when they expand beyond K and 1 will be adding older grades or just increasing one grade at a time? My son is a current 1st grader. He was accepted by NEST+M for K, but I decided not to send him since the commute would have been way too long. I would love to be able to see him find a place at one of the new schools in Brooklyn, but it’s not clear if there would be any spots available for any older children.
Comment by Anonymous — March 20, 2009 @ 12:04 pm
They are expanding one grade at a time - it seems that your son will be one year too old to qualify for any of the new programs.
Comment by Lindsey Whitton Christ — March 20, 2009 @ 12:49 pm
Hunter College Elementary School should be included in this discussion. Parents considering citywide options for 97+ children should know that Hunter is the longest running citywide option for these children. Hunter is public, but run by City College instead of DOE.
Comment by Jennifer — March 20, 2009 @ 1:49 pm
Jennifer. Hunter College Elementary School is not a citywide option. It is only open to Manhattan residents. The upper school accepts students from all 5 boroughs.
Comment by Laura — March 20, 2009 @ 2:31 pm
But PS 20 used to have a G & T program, they dissolved it last year, and now they’re putting it back in? Or was that the DOE playing havoc with G & T in all the schools? It seemed to me from talking to parents that they really LOVED the G & T teachers who used to be at G & T, but they left once the program left.
Comment by Pre-k parent — March 20, 2009 @ 2:50 pm
The G&T program at PS 20 was a District 13 program; the new one will be citywide. A new G&T testing process was instituted last year across the city and not enough students scored high enough to keep open all the programs. Some of the existing G&T programs did not accept an incoming kindergarten class and were to be phased out. There should still be G&T classes on the older grades at PS 20,though,because students already enrolled had the right to continue in G&T.
Comment by Pamela Wheaton — March 20, 2009 @ 3:18 pm
Excuse me DOE what about the Bronx?! We already have 37 children (not including any children from this year’s testing) who are being neglected in District 10 alone. What’s it going to take because I’d really like to know!
Comment by Anonymous — March 20, 2009 @ 3:22 pm
Does this mean P.S. 85 no longer will have a regular district g&t program for 90%+?
Comment by Anonymous — March 23, 2009 @ 7:18 am
I have called the G&T office to inquiry about the Queens location and their lame response was that they were not part of the selection process for the school. Wouldn’t it have made sense to host a Queens school somewhere centrally in Queens, where most Queens residents can apply? Astoria is a skip across the bridge to Manhattan, thus allowing possibly East Sides to attend. DOE should have looked at the percentage of 97%+ scores within districts and placed one there to accommodate the need for these children.
Comment by Anonymous — March 24, 2009 @ 12:50 am
To Anonymous above:
It is not as straightforward as you think. The Office of Portfolio Development, not the Enrollment Office, is the office in the DOE responsible for placing G&T programs in schools. Among the criteria used in making these decisions are not only the number of qualifying students and where they are zoned, but also the available space in a physical facility.
Comment by a parent — March 24, 2009 @ 5:57 am
I’m very disappointed to learn the location of the new citywide G&T program in Queens. I understand that DOE has to consider the availability of a physical facility, but hasn’t it just opened new schools which could have been used to (at least partially) develop a citywide G&T program at a more convenient location? And thinking about the N & W train track right before the school front door…
My daughter was accepted to TAG for K last summer, we did not send her there because the commute is too long (we live in Forest Hills). Astoria is almost as far as Manhattan for us. Even if this year she scored high enough again for 1st grade I’m not sure if we would send her to Astoria, to a school not just far away from home, but also right under subway track.
Comment by Sarah's mom — March 24, 2009 @ 12:24 pm
To Sarah’s mom,
I understand and sympathize with your concerns. As you live in Forest Hills, perhaps you could consider sending your daughter to one of the district G&T programs. They are not city-wide programs, but they may be preferable than having to endure a daily long commute. I have heard good things about PS 144 and their G&T program and they have a lot of enrichment programs in the Arts. One parent even said there is a warm atmosphere to the school. I have heard that the G&T 1st grade class at PS 101 is doing well, but their school atmosphere is much more tense, when it comes to the G&T program. The PA of PS 101 complained to the DOE that the G&T 1st grade class caused overcrowding, and when the DOE reiterated that the current G&T class would be allowed to stay at PS 101 till the terminal grade, the PA went to the Queens Chronicle and the Times Ledger as recently as January 2009 to complain. It is best to speak with current parents of the schools you will consider sending your daughter to get a feel for the vibe of the school.
Comment by Queens parent — March 24, 2009 @ 12:56 pm
I spoke to someone at P.S. 85 who told me there will no longer be a district program for children entering kindergarten and first grade. The only other district-wide options for District 30 are P.S. 122, which does not start until 2nd grade, and P.S. 150, whose parent coordinator does not return phone calls. Are there going to be ANY options for district-wide G&T programs for 1st graders in District 30?
Comment by Anonymous — March 24, 2009 @ 2:59 pm
For those D28 parents who are thinking of district G&T programs, here is some relevant information on events which happened this school year at PS 101 which would give you food for thought in your decision-making. Check out -
http://www.zwire.com/site/news.cfm?newsid=20224365&BRD=2731&PAG=461&dept_id=575596&rfi=6
http://www.bayside-times.com/articles/2009/01/22/forest_hills_ledger/news/forest_hills_ledger_newscvxuoif01212009.txt
Comment by D28 — March 24, 2009 @ 4:48 pm
To Queens parent,
Thank you very much for the info. Seems you know Forest Hills schools well. My daughter is currently in P.S. 101. I know the PA is very against G&T program and there will be no new G&T classes in the coming school year. Hopefully there will be district G&T program at P.S. 144 - I have called the district 28 enrollment office but it doesn’t seem they have any information at this moment.
Comment by Sarah's mom — March 24, 2009 @ 6:43 pm
I can add that the program at PS 85 will be under the watchfull eye of the principal with a lot of experience in T&G. I am sure that she selected great teachers for the program. If the program will stay in the school untill 8th grade will be fantastic but not clear yet. Otherwise from 6th grade the children will go to PS 122, the middle school for T&G in the area, very well established and running for a good while.
Comment by D 30 parent — March 25, 2009 @ 12:06 pm
I echo the sentiments re: G&T (90%-97%) district 30 programs, lack thereof and lack of information about these (if any) options. According to the DOE, G%T programs will start with K this year in Queens, but NO ONE seems to know where these programs will be if indeed they will exist in district 30. Any insight greatly appreciated. And it would be helpful if PS150Q Parent Coordinator would return phone calls!
Comment by Queens Mom — March 25, 2009 @ 12:43 pm
My daughter attended Kindergarten at PS56. She was accepted into a gifted and talented program. Unfortunately, PS56 does not have a gifted and talented program. So she was sent to Sputyn_Dyvil in Riverdale. In the beginning, it wqas nice to send her to nice location. However, as time went on, It became clear that PS56 offered better workshops in which free manipulatives were sometimes given. My daughter did not leave the school because our family wanted to: she left because of a good performance on a test. I wish there was some way of getting into the G&T program without entirely leaving the local school.
Comment by George Jacob — March 25, 2009 @ 2:16 pm
As a Queens parent with twins in 2nd grade, I’m happy about these programs, but frustrated as everything seems to leave my kids out in the cold. When my kids were in kindergarten, G&T in Queens didn’t start until 1st or 2nd grade. I didn’t get into any one of three alternative choice schools, so I found a private school near my house. I didn’t want to move them after a year or two. Now that I would consider it, there are no longer any options for us. Had the G&T started in kindergarten, I would have tested them at the time. Now I’m left with a public school with 1200 kids or an expensive private school as my only options.
Comment by Kim — March 25, 2009 @ 4:05 pm
To Kim,
There are G&T tests for students applying to 2nd & 3rd grades. This year these tests were done from 2/23 to 3/15. I’m not sure what programs are available for them though. You may want to call the DOE gifted program to find out.
Comment by Sarah's mom — March 25, 2009 @ 7:28 pm
Last year only 99s made NEST and Anderson.It was a lottery within each score in random order. How about this year?still
do lottery, or follow the special high school rule from high to low scores?
Comment by momof2 — March 26, 2009 @ 7:17 pm
WHAT ABOUT THE BRONX? I REALIZE THAT IT CAN TAKE A COUPLE OF YEARS TO CREATE A SCHOOL, BUT DOE, THE BRONX IS ALSO HOME TO “GIFTED” CHILDREN WHO NEED BETTER SCHOOLS!
Comment by anonymous — March 26, 2009 @ 7:55 pm
I am one of the parents who was not able to get the parent coordinator of P.S. 150Q in District 30 to return calls. I finally heard from her after calling the school office today and making some noise. She is now trying to organize a tour for next Thursday or Friday, so if anyone in District 30 is interested, please call the school on their main line and leave a message for her to call you. She said “at this time” they are planning on having a G&T program for first grade this fall; I’m not sure about K.
Comment by Anonymous — March 27, 2009 @ 12:33 pm
My daughter has received offers from all citywide G&T schools (she scored at 98th percentile). However, I am pondering to send her to local G&T schools such as ps 153 in Maspeth or ps 91 in Glandale (reason: too long and exhausting commute for my 5 year old daughter and 3 year old son; we live in Elmhurst, Queens). Do programs in 3 Manhattan schools differ significantly from district G&T programs? Does Anderson or Nest offer something much better than local G&T programs?
Comment by Aneta — May 8, 2009 @ 11:51 am
Aneta,
I’m puzzled - we haven’t received the score report yet but your daughter has already received offers, WOW! Shouldn’t DOE wait until after the application deadline to make decision?
Comment by Sarah Mom — May 8, 2009 @ 1:11 pm
My daughter got 99 percentile last year for entreing K but was not offered entry to NEST. We sent her to a local public school in Distric 1. This year she took the test again and once again scored 99. My husband call DOE and was told that her chace of getting into NEST is still very slim. We are so disappointed and at a loss of what to do with her. We live in downtown Manhattan. I’m even willing to send her to the new city-wide programs in Brooklyn and Queens. I wonder whether school bus service will be provided.
Comment by Yuhong — May 8, 2009 @ 6:32 pm
Yuhong,
I appreciate your frustration. Chances to enter the 3 citywide program in Manhattan at 1st grade are slim - K students would move up. There will only be several seats added to 1st grade in each program, which usually are taken up by siblings. However, since Brooklyn and Queens programs just start this year, your daughter will have a much better chance. The only thing is that school bus service is only provided within borough, at least that was the case last year. Would you consider sending her to a district G&T program?
Comment by Sarah Mom — May 8, 2009 @ 7:32 pm
I am little bit confused about a question on the g&t application on siblings info. I have two qualifying child one entering Kintergarden and the other entering 2nd grade. In Siblings information section, it’s asking for name of sibling’s current school(2009-2010), since both of my child are applying for g&t, I am not sure where they will be accepted. In this case what should I do? Should I put the school they are currently attending?
Comment by amar — May 18, 2009 @ 12:57 pm
Amar- yes, current school would be the school ea. child is currently attending, not prospective schools.
Comment by Bronx mom — May 18, 2009 @ 3:31 pm
in response to number 35
Parent Coordinators aren’t tour guides. If you want a tour maybe you should visit a museum!
Comment by Anonymous — January 26, 2010 @ 9:48 pm