Parents quiz DOE officials on Gifted & Talented plan: Queens

Marge Kolb, the District 24 representative to CPAC, the Chancellor's Parent Advisory Council, reports on the most frequently asked questions at the Nov. 8 Gifted & Talented town hall meeting in Queens, which was held by the Department of Education (DOE) and attended by 60-70 parents. See other Insideschools articles for details about the G&T proposal and about the timeline for admissions and questions from the Manhattan meeting. Here are some of the issues Kolb said were raised most frequently in Queens.

Testing

Q. How/why was the 95th percentile chosen as a cut-off?
A. Research shows that these are the students who need significant curriculum adjustment. This is the cut-off used by a number of other large, urban school districts, including Los Angeles , Philadelphia , and Seattle.

Q. How do the OLSAT and BSRA test scores relate to Stanford-Binet?
A. Unlike Stanford-Binet, no IQ score is yielded by the tests the city has selected.

Q. Will students NOT currently enrolled in G&T programs who are at or above the entry grade still be allowed to test for open spots in upper grades?
A. Yes, at a later time in the spring. However, District 29 in Queens just started its G&T program this year with a 1st grade class, so no seats above 2nd grade will be available next year.

Concerns about quality and curriculum

Q. Many parents, including some whose children are currently in G&T programs, raised questions and concerns about the quality and consistency of the G&T curriculum.
A. The DOE has and will continue to offer professional development and support to G&T teachers. In addition, the DOE website offers G&T units of study which are aligned with the state standards. Marcia Lyles, deputy chancellor for teaching and learning, said she met on Nov. 7 with principals whose schools have G&T programs to share with them concerns over the curriculum.

Transportation

Q. A few parents had questions about whether there will be busing for children enrolled in G&T programs.
A. DOE officials had no real answer to the busing question, although they told one parent they would look into her individual situation. (Ed. note: At the Manhattan forum, DOE officials said there would be no busing across district lines.)

Q. Why are the three city-wide G&T programs, which serve the highest scoring students (97th percentile), all located in Manhattan and with no transportation provided for those living in the other four boroughs?
A. There was no real answer. Officials said they may look into this.

Q. Why do almost all the programs in Queens begin in 1st grade while in Manhattan almost all begin in kindergarten?
A. Lyles indicated that the starting grades for G&T were decision made by the districts, or regions. When asked how individual districts in Queens could go back to beginning G&T programs in kindergarten, she had no answer.

Class size

Q. Are class sizes in G&T classes capped? One parent stated there were 34 children in her child's G&T class.
A. There are no special caps for gifted classes - they can go up to the contractual limits. (Parents noted that there are informal or formal caps on class size in some programs.)

Middle school

Q. What is the plan for G&T students at the middle school level?
A. This proposal only covers elementary school programs. The central enrollment office (OSEPO) will be working on a middle school catalog, but there is no proposal to change G&T on the middle school level.

Other questions and concerns

School transfers: DOE officials said that once a child is in a G&T program at a specific site in their district, they cannot transfer schools to a different G&T program. Why this is the case was not elaborated upon. (Ed. note: DOE officials have not answered this question consistently. At the Manhattan meeting, DOE officials said students would be able to retest and re-apply to new programs each year.)

Certified teachers: Since many districts may have to add G&T programs, where will all the certified teachers come from? (Even if a few G&T programs are eliminated, there is no guarantee that those teachers will move from the schools where the currently teach.)

Create more programs for older students: Why not create additional classes at higher grades if enough children test at the 95th percentile? Parents of current 2nd and 3rd graders expressed concern that their children would only be able to compete for an extremely small number of seats which open up in the higher grades. If a child has newly moved into a district, didn't perform up to his/her abilities when tested in a previous year, or is an immigrant who has now sufficiently developed English skills, shouldn't the DOE be able to accommodate him/her at higher grades?

For more details from Queens, see Kolb's extended summary at NYC Public School Parents. For information about upcoming public meetings, check out the Insideschools calendar. And let us know what parents in your area are saying about the proposed changes to G&T.